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inquisitive
Joined: Wed, May 24 2006
Location: Brisvegas
Posts: 379
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RE: Is needling by Massage Therapists warranted
Tue, May 11 2010 5:55 PM
Ahhh, I like trees...you pretend to hold so much cred when you obviously are as green as spring grass. Do you have 'Myotherapy' tattooed on your heart?
You remind of a fanatical religous freak who can't see the other side for looking.
keep it simple stupid
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RadicalPosture
Joined: Wed, Nov 16 2005
Posts: 211
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RE: Is needling by Massage Therapists warranted
Fri, Mar 26 2010 11:08 PM
i woz a rmt then i did mdn course = now i'm a smokin dry needler = i'm with you treemeister i'm not one of those moggie rmt anymor - zinggggaarrrr
"Better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool than open it and remove all doubt." SIr Denis Thatcher
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RadicalPosture
Joined: Wed, Nov 16 2005
Posts: 211
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RE: Is needling by Massage Therapists warranted
Fri, Mar 26 2010 11:05 PM
dude - the streeet cred is shot to hell with this bird - she adverts that shes with this atms wannabee almost assoction http://www.iict.com.au/about-us.htm = if she wants cred she shoould flick this mob as her accredit statis = rp
"Better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool than open it and remove all doubt." SIr Denis Thatcher
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iliketrees
Joined: Thu, Nov 22 2007
Posts: 37
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RE: Is needling by Massage Therapists warranted
Fri, Mar 26 2010 9:48 AM
Short answer. No. RMTs should not be learning MDN because the level of education is vastly inconsistant, and not valid for advanced dry-needling practice.
Long answer, they will go and learn it anyway.
The best course available is http://www.myofascial-dry-needling.com. She holds the highest standards when teaching the program, is highly engaging, extremely academic AND practical in her approach.
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inquisitive
Joined: Wed, May 24 2006
Location: Brisvegas
Posts: 379
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RE: Is needling by Massage Therapists warranted
Wed, Sep 09 2009 11:18 AM
I think what needs to be considered with the MDN workshops is that the training isn't only four days. To enter the workshop you need to have a minimum level of training. Hence the training realistically is years, not days.
If you were to do MDN alone, you would have to be trained in anat, phys, path, etc, and then the actual specifics of MDN. But because these people have done all that before entering the MDN course, they are considerably more trained than the four days of the course.
Note, if you did the hours over 12 months, say two per week, would you tell the clients you have done a 12 month course? Or the same hours in hte four days but over 12 months?
Consider BOND uni in queensland. They do two year business degrees. Two years? Must be shit hey? Well they do it in two years because they only have 6 weeks off per year and not 24 weeks like other uni's. Hence they get the same degree, in the same hours, but more concentrated learning.
keep it simple stupid
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ThePhantom
Joined: Fri, Jul 28 2006
Posts: 89
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RE: Is needling by Massage Therapists warranted
Wed, Jul 15 2009 8:50 PM
It sounds like the MDN workshop that you did was very ordinary (that is, the 4-dayer). I'd research them again, and go and do a better MDN workshop. Just because you've done one poor workshop on MDN shouldn't taint your opinion. It took me 3 years of looking before I found a presenter and a workshop that I felt was comprehensive enough for me.
On the disclosure of Informed Consent, if you are going so far as to detail your training, you may as well disclose your grades and your attendance too !
I love to doubt as well as know.
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nhingley
Joined: Tue, Jul 7 2009
Posts: 2
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RE: Is needling by Massage Therapists warranted
Mon, Jul 13 2009 10:11 AM
Thanks to all responses and respondees!!
the more i have researched this the more i realize the difference in my training to MDN. In writing these guidelines i wish to make sure i dont discriminate based on my training.
I understand that some may think the only similarity is the needles but i do disagree to a certain extent. The anatomy is the same, the aseptic procedures are the same, the risks are the same. I dont wish to be critical i just want to open up discussion so i can write these guidelines fairly.
AMT is my association who have a draft on MND protocol, unless they have completed over the last week!
i have read AAMT's protocol.
I think needling is great and anyone has the ability to do it but i think we should possibly look at longer workshops that are competancy based. I have asked several patients if they would allow someone to needle them after doing a 4 day workshop, with 100% answering no.
As part of my informed consent i let my patients know what training i have done. Perhaps this should be part of the guidelines?
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alliedsofttissue
Joined: Thu, Apr 6 2006
Location: Victoria
Posts: 99
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RE: Is needling by Massage Therapists warranted
Wed, Jul 08 2009 8:09 PM
Hello Nina,
Couple of issues here.
Firstly conducting training over 1 year does not make 1 year of training we need to talk in hours to compare equivalency. You cant do 2 minutes a day over 10 years and call it 10 years training (just an example).
Secondly I believe the old training at RMIT pre training package, as it stands that you completed had very little to do with dry needling needling a lot to to do with acupuncture theory (not having a shot at you here), hence myofascial acupunture being the name.
Thirdly and phantom is correct the only similarities are the needles, MDN is a different technique, different philosophy and an entirely different treatment outcome from practitioner perspective.
Welcome to the forum.
AST
Concordia res parvae crescent
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ThePhantom
Joined: Fri, Jul 28 2006
Posts: 89
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RE: Is needling by Massage Therapists warranted
Tue, Jul 07 2009 9:15 PM
You may need to divulge some more information.
Much has changed from the old course you did (by the sounds of it). The MDN at RMIT is more of a post-grad thing. Same goes for some other courses. There are 2 day courses, but, with little substance - they're probably the dangerous courses.
On that note, any therapy can be potentially harmful, if conducted in an unsafe way, or without regard for OH&S guidelines.
Not too sure of your angle comparing Acupuncture and MDN. They are completely different therapeutic approaches. The only similarity is the use of needles.
AMT NSW and AAMT both have MDN policies in place now. Thay may be on their websites, or failing that you may need to call them.
I'd also be interested to hear who you are planning to teach at Southern Health.
I love to doubt as well as know.
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nhingley
Joined: Tue, Jul 7 2009
Posts: 2
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RE: Is needling by Massage Therapists warranted
Tue, Jul 07 2009 5:08 PM
Have just read this thread as a Myo trying to write some dry needling guidelines/protocol for Southern Health.
I am an old Myo (one who didnt have to do RMT first)
who uses dry needling. i am trying to find some sort of protocol to back up my beliefs but none exist.
I dont understand why we completed 1 yr of myofascial acupuncture when anyone can go and do a 4 day workshop and practice this potentially harmful therapy. At RMIT we completed 5 days of theory then an exam before we were allowed to pick up a needle. Im finding it hard to support RMT and physios etc who do the workshop and consider themselves safe needlers. Im sure acupuncturists consider what we did at RMIT basic! id love to hear some pros and cons to fairly write these protocols so as to not leave out a potentially excellent dry needler!!
cheers
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